Monday, November 27, 2006

Arguments for fun…and….

Arguments run the world. Arguments ruin the world. If Benjamin Franklin had not argued with the mundane, and tried out the iron kite experiment, I would not have been able to pen this blog on a computer that runs on electricity, nor would you have been able to read this on the monitor that runs on it. It was the ‘argument’ that led to this wonderful discovery.
But, weren’t the arguments between powerful nations that led to all those wars???
Are arguments good, or bad?

“This coffee is very sweet. I should have opted for the tea,” my friend, a chronic argument specialist, blurted out at a breakfast table, at the workplace cafeteria.
“How is it going to be different? The tea is going to have the same milk, and hence the same amount of sweetness,” I uttered, casually.
The presence of two sweet looking dames along with us, at our table, called my friend for a show of his incorrigible arguing skills.
“The sugar is put into the decoction. Not the milk,” he said, smiling at me.
“Nope. Sugar is generally put into the milk,” I spoke, recalling the incident when my uncle had requested for a sugarless coffee at a self-service restaurant, the thin bearded ‘coffee-guy’ at the smoke charred corner of the restaurant had scooped up milk and a lot of froth, from a different container.

The smile on the face of my friend withdrew back to a mild frown.
“No, I perfectly know. The sugar is put to the decoction,” he said, now more of an argument. A sweep of my glance at the girls in the table told me that they were getting unnerved as my friend readied himself to another battle.
“I don’t agree. There are two containers in all hotels, one for sweet milk, and one for sugarless. The decoction is placed in a single filter, and it is always sugarless,” I said, firmly this time. I wanted to win this argument. Yes, I had witnesses too, which made the game exciting.
“You don’t know anything about running a hotel. Having sweet and sugarless milk in huge containers is a loss to them. They might as well be maintaining the sweet and sugarless decoctions in small containers,” he argued, now with stronger points, with a try to attack my ego.
“I agree that I don’t know anything about running a hotel, but I know for sure that sweet and sugarless is determined by the milk, and not the decoction,” I refused to budge from my point, not to be towed away by his secondary lines of argument.
He nodded furiously.
It was getting very exciting, and the idea of a perfect kill suddenly erupted in me. “What say we have a bet on this? I will bet you for a hundred bucks on this…..no…no….let us make this a thousand bucks,” I said, trying to trap him, in the presence of the two uncomfortable girls, who had not wanted this, early in the morning.
“Sure,” he blurted out.
And then, he did not drag it further, as would he would have done in normal circumstances, with his regular gyan about general things in life, and many other special things that he knows, that I didn’t knew, etc. He had been cornered. And I had won the argument. And I felt elated.

On a Sunday, at home, “Dad, I need this place free of clutter today,” I told my dad, pointing to a corner in the sitting room, where my father had heaped old newspapers. He was searching for some old articles. “Give me a few days, I will have them sorted out,” he said.
“No, you had already promised a month back that you would free the place from this clutter. Then you went on a tour for a week. The week after that, you were involved in your seminars, and hence I did not tell you to get it done,” I argued. I had the facts with me.
“The tour was very important for me. I had to get stuff done for my photography exhibition next month. I had to go. I met up with a lot of people at the seminars, who are useful to me. Give me one more week, and I promise to have this sorted out,” he said.
“No, I am sure you would come up with some other convincing reason, not to get this thing done,” I said.
“You think that I am giving you reasons?” he was irritated now.
“Yes. They are reasons, and they are convincing enough. But, reasons do not get the work done,” I said. Yes, it was a valid argument.
“Do you think I am lying?” he asked me.
“No. You have very good reasons. But, at the end of the day, reasons do not help me. Action will,” I put in a point, which he was not able to refute.
He just stayed silent.
I had won the argument.
I had been the victor.
He was sad, and angry.
I refused to reconcile, because I was right, and he was wrong. I had just won the argument. How could I be wrong?
But why was the voice in me screaming, that I was wrong?
Why wasn’t I elated after winning the argument?

Now, looking at these two scenarios objectively, in the first instance I was arguing to win, and in the second instance, I was arguing to make my father understand. But, in the second instance, I messed up when I began to argue to win, rather than argue to make him understand.
I had won.
But I had lost.

It is not an isolated case. Isn’t it very general for us to take up arguments because we don’t think that something is right? But, during the argument, we tend to take things personally, get agitated and in result ruin relationships.
Do you remember the last time you had started out in an argument to criticize the Indian cricket team for their performance, and got badgered by the others who supported the team passionately? After a while, the concept of logical discussion disappears, and what are left are the personal insults, victories, and a lot of judgments about each other.


Arguing to win

Drawing a clear distinction between the two types of arguments, I would say that ‘Arguing to win’ to be treated as a game. In a game, some teams win, and some teams lose. But both the teams are better off than where they were prior to playing.
In a game, if you win you feel good. But if you lose….. c’mon… it is after all a game. Don’t forget the learning, though.

When you win, while ‘Arguing to Win’, it also becomes your job to respect the losing side. It is because of the other side that you got a chance to play this game. It is very possible that there could be another chance to sharpen up your skills, if the losing side picks up another argument. This is only possible if the losing side is given due respect after losing the argument. Hence, an ambience for a lot of arguments open up, which fosters clarity of thought process, share of knowledge and quick thinking. More the arguments, merrier are the surroundings.
To exemplify,
“Ram Jethmalani is my idol,” a friend told me sometime back.
“Why?” I was curious.
“Wait, I will forward you the interview that he had with Karan Thapar on CNN-IBN,” he said, and sent me an excerpt of the interview. After going through the interview, I felt that it was a waste of time. Karan and Jethmalani had been loitering more time in personal insults, rather than discussing real issues dealing with the esteemed lawyer representing Manu Sharma. Manu Sharma is the prime accused in Jessica Lal murder case that is rocking the Indian media currently.
“Budd, did you make Ram Jethmalani your idol after going through this interview?” I asked my friend.
“Yes, he is a great lawyer. If he can get Manu Sharma out, he can get anybody out,” he said.
Ah! This was a great opportunity to ‘Argue to win’.
“What is there in the interview that makes him a great personality?” I asked him.
“He was able to answer all of Karan’s answers back in the same way he received it. He almost slapped Karan, the hardest of all TV interviewers,” answered my friend.
“Jethmalani has been a supreme court lawyer for more than 50 years. He has been arguing even before Karan was wearing chaddis. Do you really base your idols on this kind of logic?”
There was no response from my friend for a while.
“Budd,” I continued, “I think that this interview is a big waste of time. There is nothing of importance discussed but a mutual exchange of personal insults. A great TV interviewer against one of the top lawyers of the country…and they come up with this??? I am no smarter after reading this interview.”
The bubble of my friend seemed to have been burst.
After a while of silence, “Let’s discuss this after lunch,” he said.
The topic was never discussed again.
The next day, I sent him a message, “Don’t take our arguments personal, I was just arguing for the sake of arguing.”
After all, he did have the right to make anybody his idol in this world.

In this approach, you can get down and dirty in the arguments, where you can try to manipulate the interpretations of the facts, and present them to support your case. This would more resemble the reality shows on TV, in front of a hidden camera, where the TV crew irritates the general public. Then, when the reality is revealed, the targets end up with a smile.
An open mindset in very essential for this, to accept victory or failure with a smile. Victory or failure should not be taken personal, but just as a part of the game. So what if you lost this time, it is a game. You can always win it the next time.
No, it doesn’t require a different ‘YOU’ to win the argument. Just better preparation. ;-)
Just remember the part about ‘respecting the losing side’. A very essential point, to prevent the relationship from going haywire, after the argument.

Arguing to understand

There are no wins or losses in ‘Arguing to make one understand’. There needs be understanding between the participants of the arguments, irrespective of the result of the argument. This type of argument is more to understand each other, and move towards a better future together. The readiness to accept defeat on being proved wrong logically, for the greater good of the relationship is to be borne in mind. Deliberate misinterpretations of the facts in this scenario, would not only ruin the relationship, but also would prove detrimental in the move towards progress.
The move should be more towards understanding, rather than arguing.

In the context of difference of opinions, it becomes your job to find different methods of making the other person understand what you mean. Also, you will need to address the deep-rooted fears that are driving the individual to come up with his/her opinion.
If you would go on these lines of thoughts, whether you win or lose, you would definitely move towards the better future of each other.

But, does it mean simple surrender of beliefs?

No. A big NO.

How can you convince the other person of your point of view?

I have a personal example. Let’s see if this helps. J

A wall of a well-lit room in my house had to be painted. Each member of the family wanted his/her colours. My mother wanted a light yellow, sister wanted an electric blue.
This was a well-lit room. Actually, it was a glaringly lit room, and I wanted a dark wall to balance the light in the room.
My mother is against any dark walls, as she believes that darker shades lead to depressive moods. Further, she argued that she was the one who would be staying in the house for most of the time, and she did not want to have depressing shades on the walls.
I had seen the blue coloured dark ‘Armada Blue’ in one of the restaurants I had been to. I had loved the colour, and thought that it would be an ideal colour for the wall.
I put across my suggestion, but was shot down.
On arguing, I felt that I was not moving anywhere. As I did an analysis of my type of argument, I realized that I was trying to prove my point, rather than understand the fears that my mother nurtured.
She had not seen the colour, and hence, was skeptical about it.
She had not seen what I had seen. No amount of explaining would make her see what I am seeing.
Suddenly, I struck upon an idea.
I took out my digital camera, shot the picture of the wall in the room, loaded it in my computer, and digitally added that colour to the wall in the picture. I had my sister and my mother have a look at the picture.
Two days later, the wall stood gracefully, attired in dark ‘Armada blue’. ;-)

In here, argument takes a back seat, but the person/ people become more important. Understanding the other person’s point of view is very essential before putting across your argument. For all you know, the other person may have a suggestion that is better than yours. Accepting the other person’s suggestion should not be considered as defeat, but as a mark of progress.

Hence, irrespective of the result of the argument, you have won in the relationship.

Isn’t that more important?? ;-)

Just to summarize, decide beforehand whether you are arguing to win or arguing to understand. If you are arguing to win, try winning at any cost. If you lose, it is a game. If you win, it still is a game. ;-)
But, respect the losing side.

If you are arguing to understand, don’t try to win. Try to move towards betterment than the present.

Hope you have a great time arguing.

Thejas
(ps: only the examples where I have won the argument have been quoted. There are equal number of instances where I have lost, and many times have been treated with respect after losing ;-) )

13 comments:

Anonymous said...

Good thoughts Teju. I think arguments start from difference of opinions. We form opinions on the basis of our knowledge or lack of it, our bringup, prejudices etc.

How it ends depends on the parties involved. If the parties are interested in clearing their misconceptions, happy-ending.

If its driven by ego, to dominate others, its always an unhealthy argument. Not good !

I am not convinced about the "argument to understand" category. If one is willing and motivated to understand something, he would never start it as an arguemnt. Ofcourse, the first category that I mentioned, it might "end" in one party understanding the other. But even those dont start with an intension to understand.

Just to add some more spice to your milk/sugar debate, in most of the hotels I visited, they dont add sugar to neither dicaction nor milk, they serve sugar cubes separately:)

Cheers,
Vijay Hegde

Enigma said...

hm indded good post! shall write my views in an elaborate post :)

Thejas Rajaram said...

hey Vijay,

Thanks for stopping by.

I believe that you treat 'argument to understand' more of an argument. My view is different.
'Arguing to understand would be more to do with presenting of opinions based on facts, rather than feelings, from each side'. The one with the most convincing opinion depending on facts would win the argument. But, more important is that the losing side is left with more knowledge about facts which he/she didn't know previously. The winning side is also left with more knowledge about it. Hence, though one might win, the other losing, it does happen that the winning side won because he had better/more facts. Hence, though the losing side ends up understanding the winning side, both sides are better off than where they were previously. Also, the losing side is left with better knowledge, to win, if he/she indulges in 'argument to win' with some other person, the next time ;-)

what do you think ?? :D

hey enigma,
thanks for stopping by. Yes, am waiting for your comments :)

The Avenger !!! said...

well said dude, very very impressive.

I have had arguments before and in the latest one i argued to win and in the process lost more than what i bargained for.

Hopefully after reading this my arguments would be towards better understanding and not winning or losing.

After all its just a GAME. I am glad i realised it atleast albeit a bit late !!!

Anonymous said...

Hi, its an interesting tocpic and good write up :-) The below lines represent a very good insight by you.

In the context of difference of opinions, it becomes your job to find different methods of making the other person understand what you mean.
Also, you will need to address the deep-rooted fears that are driving the individual to come up with his/her opinion

This was followed by a perfect example

On the other note I do not understand arguments having two different concepts why do you restrict yourself in applying the above thought to all your arguments

Thejas Rajaram said...

thanks 'the avenger'...
just a thought... realisation is never late...you might have missed something.. but as you now realise what you miss due to the arguing, i would think that you can get it back by admitting frankly with the person with whom you had this argument ... try it... it will work :)

anonymous...

thanks for stopping by...

Actually, I did not understand your question properly. I will try rephrasing it and answer it. Lemme know if I got it right.

I guess, you are asking me that why don't I apply the 'Arguing to Understand' in all areas? why restrict myself to only some areas?

The answer for this is, that according to me would be preaching something that I do not follow. I believe, if there is always 'arguing to understand', there is no spice in life. And hence, become a lil boring, and not comfortable. But thatz me.

I want to act bad, crooked, and an outright lair sometimes. I want to pull all lines of argument to win, sometimes. And during this time, I should not take the arguments personally, to be left emotionally comfortable at the end of the argument. Hence, the drawing of the distinction between the two methodologies of arguments.

Anonymous said...

I understand that you want to spice up your life but in the process of ‘arguing to win’ it looks like the other person left embarrassed and disempowered next time he will think twice to take up any arguments with you
In your Ram Jethmalani’s argument, generally people like in others what they do not have in them, may be he is not good at answering back to others and his idol is based on that skill (which could be the reason he didn’t continue the argument with you)But in your case you were looking for something else out of that interview excerpt, I am sure you do understand all this but you were ‘arguing to win’ and your argument was totally valid

My thoughts here are after winning the argument in your example if you provide the space for the other person to open up and accept defeat and make him think do we really base our idols on one particular skill which we do not posses and the other person do.
By this you are adding spice to your life and the other person left empowered at the end of the argument and not afraid of taking up any other arguments with you in future. In this process your arguments are helping him to think and alter his opinions to add better meaning to the life. At the end he will know why you were acting bad, crooked and like an outright liar which you are actually NOT.

This was not to invalidate you in any way but just to put across a different perspective.

**

Thejas Rajaram said...

hey Anonymous,

You are totally right about it. That would be very logical. When I am providing space for the other person to open up and accept defeat, both of us would be complete with the arguments, whether we win or lose.

But, this logic is very difficult for me to implement. Hence, though I would love to preach that, it would be dishonest on my part to say that, because I myself do not follow that. I am in the first level of distinction where I am just separating the arguments into easily recognisable patterns, and hence choosing one of them will result in a clarity of what we are trying to do.

I would totally agree with the extension that you have provided for the arguing for winning, but at this stage, I am too small a person to comment about it. :)

I would just stick to accepting that I argued for the sake of arguing, with the other person, at the present reality. :)

Anonymous said...

Hi Thejas ,
A nice well written article , the one place i'd beg to differ is the place where u say the two teams would have been better off before facing each other , the way I see it , it would be a real high for the winning team and of course a very valuable lesson learnt at the expense of a loss to the losing team , but they're both better off after the battle . But it could be my perception alone :)
Yeah and a lot of places i know do add sugar to the milk and i know this for a fact as I've always had them mixing the two to customize my drink :)

Cheers,
Sindhu.

Thejas Rajaram said...

hi Sindhu,

Thanks for commenting. :)

In your comment, in this line, I believe that you have not interpreted me correctly.

"the one place i'd beg to differ is the place where u say the two teams would have been better off before facing each other"

I guess you think that I am trying to say that both teams were better before the arguments. I do not mean this. I mean

"whether you win or lose, you would definitely move towards the better future of each other."

Hence, I guess, I am in agreement with your thoughts.

Anonymous said...

Hi Thejas ,
my apologies , on a closer look i realized i missed the "than" in the sentence :) .

Cheers,
Sindhu.

Harish Narayana Bhat said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Harish Narayana Bhat said...

Hi Tejas,

A really nice writeup. I am of the opinion that in an argument nobody should be a winner nor a losser. But most of the time people take it personally and if they win they think they are correct!! (which i dont like). A win in an argument makes one feel just like a batsman who's confidence level increases after hitting a boundary.
In most of the argument you might have observed that if one is at a losing end he would shout at top of his voice to convince the other guy. Put some more incidents where you have experienced it...

BestRegards,
Harish